CHOP CULT HOME
Email Password
Search
  1. #1
    Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    35

    Default 1966 Triumph Bonneville Oil Feed

    Helloooooo! Can anyone tell me which is the oil feed line and which is the return line on a 1966 Triumph Bonneville when looking at the bottom of the engine from the right side? In other words the 2 steel tubings going to the oil pump, one is closer to the right (frame) and the other is closer to the left (engine) Would I connect the oil feed hose to the engine/oil pump closest to the right side or left side? This is a chopper and I have nothing to reference.
    Thanks, Geargeezer

  2. #2
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    304

    Default

    Nothing but the manual.
    Pull the lines at the motor and the one that oil pours out from gravity from the tank is feed.
    Attach this to the forward most connector on the motor.

  3. #3
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Posts
    2,951

    Default

    Front=Feed
    Rear=Return

    Feed is to engine Return is to tank.

    Oil line Hookup

    "Answer to question we get asked every day on Triumph unit 500/650/750 is how to hook up oil lines, as service manual is not very helpful on this information, and hooking backwards equals disaster:

    ON OIL JUNCTION JUNCTION BLOCK THAT BOLTS TO CRANKCASE,
    OUTER PIPE, FARTHER TO REAR OF ENG. IS RETURN, AND INNER, FORWARD PIPE IS FEED.
    Easy way to remember is R to R, F to F - Rear to Return, Front to Feed."

    http://www.britcycle.com/Manuals/Oil_Line_Hookup.htm


    Thread: triumph oil line routing ???

    "the 78 is like all unit Triumphs the front pipe is the feed and rear is the return.
    it gets a little confusing when the wrap around sideways but just follow it up, if it is the line closest to the front of the motorcycle it is the feed line.
    and just in case, the feed line comes from the bottom of the oil tank / backbone tube."

    "front feed rear return...say it 20 times... and you'll remember..."

    http://www.chopcult.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8036

  4. #4
    Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    35

    Default

    Thanks for this information!!! Bike has been sitting to 21 years and I don't want to blow it up after it's long hibernation!! I actually almost got it started earlier today but was unsuccessful. It will fire but only idles for about 3 seconds. I think it's getting to much gas (plugs wet with gas). Not sure if I wired it correctly but I am getting spark. This bike was set up with points, a dual coil (like used on Harleys) & with one condenser connected to the coil. Hopefully I can get it going before long.
    Thx Geargeezer

  5. #5
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    1,120

    Default

    Hate to pee on your parade, But research SLUDGE TRAP! Its totally acceptable to get one running for "Proof of life" but for the love of God & Edward Turner PLEASE PLEASE dont go riding it.

    That sludge trap inside the crank needs cleaning out, and I mean CLEAN!!! Plus the oil lines and oil bag/tank. Then use a modern 20-50 multi with a return line oil filter, Look up the Norton oil filter kits and make sure there is no flapper-check valve in the filter as most modern ones have those. You dont want it on a old motor like this.

    See for oil use on vintage motors : https://www.accessnorton.com/Oil-Tests/NortonOil.php

    On a old motor, If all is good, then you do a tear down, hone the cyls, lap the valves, and all new seals and gaskets. Worst case you find worn out shit and be happy you were not a dumb ass and blew it up.

  6. #6
    Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    35

    Default

    Jeezzz.... forgot about the potential sludge trap obstruction nightmare. What a crazy design! Is there any way to tell if the oil flow to the bottom end (motor in general) is adequate while letting the bike idle for a while? In other words is there any way to tell if there is not an issue with the sludge trap or is the only way to split the cases and remove the crank? Looks like this is going to be a long project. Such is life. Need to get into a Triumph Zen mood!

    Thx Geargeezer

  7. #7

    Default

    100% yes to sludge trap cleaning. And isnt the return pipe diameter larger than the feed on bonnevilles? It is on my t100, makes it hard to inadvertently switch the hoses.

  8. #8
    Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    35

    Default

    Nope, the diameter of the oil feed and return on the junction block are the same diameter which causes some confusion when using a custom oil tank. TriNotycopz is correct with his response:
    "ON OIL JUNCTION JUNCTION BLOCK THAT BOLTS TO CRANKCASE,
    OUTER PIPE, FARTHER TO REAR OF ENG. IS RETURN, AND INNER, FORWARD PIPE IS FEED.
    Easy way to remember is R to R, F to F - Rear to Return, Front to Feed."
    I agree with you and Dougtheinternetannoyan after some research it would be best to clean (at least check the sludge trap. Wow...lots of work!

    Thx Geargeezer

  9. #9
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    1,120

    Default

    Assuming nothing terrible inside, Its a weekend of wrenching, even less if you do them often. But I would advise take your time and do it right. Its all basic stuff, and easy, But there is a ton of small details to make sure of. The rods go pear shaped so often need big end resized, the bores wear on front & rear thrust surfaces, But if its in decent shape, no machine shop needed assuming you know how to measure and have a ball hone and some basic tools, You can even lap in your valves yourself.

    While you are at it, Replace the sludge trap plug with a hex that makes them easier to remove & replace. Make sure its nice and clean and clean the threads with brake clean or Acetone and then loctite in place with Blue, make sure it does not block off the oil passage when installed.

    When firing up a new motor, or testing one thats sat, I do the basic cleaning of ALL lines, and the oil bag/tank. Open the rocker caps, No spark plugs and remove the sump plug. You CAN jack up the back end and turn the tire to turn it over, But kicking over & over you should see oil flow and out the bottom. Look carefully of what comes out. Then put the sump plug back in, and continue until it flows back INTO the tank. Check timing and valve lash as well with the caps off.

    On aftermarket tanks people often get the rocker feed line wrong. There should be a obstruction enough to get goldilocks flow to the head, Not too much, not too little. If its a Custom, not a restoration, I dont run the oil return rocker feed at all. I run a small carb jet in a line off the Pressure relief passage or the Take off plug on the timing cover.

    This is critical on the late Triumph TSS 8 valve heads. But its a good mod for any Triumph or British twin. For some context, see the BSA B50 mod page on this topic.

    See: http://www.b50.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=5315
    " "Like many other British bikes, these have the clever design of having some of the oil returning from the sump routed up to oil the head. This of course means the oil has been heated by the engine, and is also not the best way of guaranteeing a steady supply of oil. So, block off the return tube on the underside of the motor (Figure 1-A), and put a fitting that's been restricted to 0.020" into the oil pressure sending switch hole (Figure 2-E). "
    &
    " I have done this since the late 1960s on Triumph dirt track twins and in the 70s on B50s. I use a Weatherhead brass fitting with a 1/16 inch (0.0625) restrictor The Triumph twins were plain bearing bottom ends and the B50 is roller. No problems."

    HP By Stan was one of the top race engine builders in the vintage BI world, He says.,,,,,
    " two problems with the stock system of using the return oil line, is it lubricates the top end more at idle than at high rpm AND if the return side of the pump is working correctly, it's pumping at least 50% heated air. Whom among us think those are good plans?"

    Obviously a BSA B50 thumper is different, But you can get the gist here: http://b50.org/ccmmods.htm

    On suspect motors and testing, I keep some mono grade Walmart generic 30wt, and run it thru coffee filters. This never goes in a motor thats new or will be ridden, Its just for proof of life and testing. After using it, I pour it thru stacked coffee filters and then replace it back into a clean container until next time.

    On new builds, I break them in on NON DETERGENT 30 wt for the first startups,, depending on motor, I might run it for 20 miles or so, Change and then another 100-300 miles. Once I am sure the rings are seating in, I switch to 20w-50 Multi grade, but in light of research, I am revamping what brands of oils I am using, so see that link on the Norton page I posted. Modern oils are NOT made for our old iron. Dont assume anything. Its hard to find anything good,. In a pinch I run Delo 400 tractor and diesel oil.

  10. #10
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    336

    Default

    There's no way to verify what state the sludge trap is it is in without splitting the cases. You can add an oil pressure gauge in place of the oil pressure switch to monitor pressure at idle. A healthy motor is usually doing like 15-20 psi at tickover.

  11. #11
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    1,120

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CarloFreeze View Post
    There's no way to verify what state the sludge trap is it is in without splitting the cases. You can add an oil pressure gauge in place of the oil pressure switch to monitor pressure at idle. A healthy motor is usually doing like 15-20 psi at tickover.
    Id generally agree except on Oil pressure as thats more variable,
    A) It depends on where you take your pressure readings, There is several ways to plug in a oil gauge and not all the same (Nortons generally off the head feed)
    B) Cold or hot? Variable, but thats why I LOVE a oil gauge so you are more careful on warm up so you dont abuse the motor. *Flow is more important than pressure PSI every time
    C) Roller bearing vs plain shell? BSA vs Triump or Norton? Some motors run a plain shell bearing on timing side such as BSA and pre 68 or 69 Triumph 500s and that makes a difference. Roller bearing motors like a BSA Gold star B34, or most singles dont ever see high pressures.
    D) TYPE of oil, mono grades take forever to warm up to proper consistency, I generally run a Multi like 20-50w with a lot of detergents and use an inline return filter.

    I run a pressure gauge and idiot light,, the sensor I use is typically rated at 5 or 7 psi depending on the build on very low tickover on a Triumph 650-750 I can see as low as 5psi and my idiot light will flicker, and I usually use a Morgo Hi volume pump! A COLD motor on startup can peg over 100PSI so always use a gauge with a good range as it can be damaged if not.

    Norton and Triumph eliminated idiot lights for oil pressure because it scared owners and resulted in more warranty claims. I have the service dealers bulletins on this.
    D)

  12. #12

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by geargeezer View Post
    Nope, the diameter of the oil feed and return on the junction block are the same diameter which causes some confusion when using a custom oil tank. TriNotycopz is correct with his response:
    "ON OIL JUNCTION JUNCTION BLOCK THAT BOLTS TO CRANKCASE,
    OUTER PIPE, FARTHER TO REAR OF ENG. IS RETURN, AND INNER, FORWARD PIPE IS FEED.
    Easy way to remember is R to R, F to F - Rear to Return, Front to Feed."
    I agree with you and Dougtheinternetannoyan after some research it would be best to clean (at least check the sludge trap. Wow...lots of work!

    Thx Geargeezer
    Another detail where the 650's are less refined than the 500's then. Interesting.

  13. #13
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    336

    Default

    I should have mentioned 15-20 PSI at idle is normal on when the oil is at operating temp, cold would be much higher. A oil filled gauge for pressure is what you want. Another couple things worth mentioning is to check the crankshaft oil seal (inside the timing cover) and Pressure Relief Valve to make sure it is moving freely.

Share This



Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Log in

Log in