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Thread: G&L Choppers

  1. #41
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    So what you are saying is that everybody who sent bikes/parts/$$$ should just "suck it up" and deal?!?

    You know what they say about "Good Intentions"

    Life's tough for lots of folks, but that's not an "out" to duck responsibility...

    Maybe the guy who gave his bike and $4000.00 needs to take care of someone too.

    You take the money, you take the bike, you take the parts, better be prepared to give it back if you can't do the job.

    Anything else is just a cop-out.

  2. #42
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    The original guy sent his stuff over three years ago, the latest one was a few months ago. If the guy had to shut down his shop why is he still taking money from new customers?! Or telling magazines he's still in business. If what your saying is true, I think him simply letting people know what's going on might help just a little, instead of hiding from everyone.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by toxiceric View Post
    Well, I'm going to chime in here and I'm sure, be labeled as a co-conspiritor, but whatever. For those of you that love nothing better than to bash someone and make it a point to get everyone on your side without ever hearing the other guys side, I'm sure you won't care, but, here it is.

    I won't drag this out, but Rich is NOT a crook. Like so many others in this industry that have actual full time shops, he was unable to keep it going for multiple reasons. The most important being the health of a family member. He had to close his shop to take care of someone who fell ill earlier this year. Other things happened as well. Things out of anyones control. I'm not going to tell the whole story, as it's not my place, but I do consider Rich to be a friend and there are many half truths being told here. I'm sure no one cares, but there it is.

    He is trying to make things right with people a little at a time. Perhaps, if you tried being kind and showed the tiniest bit of understanding, you might get somewhere with this. Making demands and getting in someones face and bashing them anywhere someone will listen doesn't help. Just curious, when's the last time someone got in your face about something and you actually felt like helping them? Hmmm? More so, if someone demands something from you, i.e. money, and you don't have it, where exactly should you get it? People have lost their homes over circumstances beyond their control.

    Here's the bottom line. Unless you have been self employed with a full time business, and I'm not talking about a home based whatever, you don't understand what it takles to keep a business going and how it can all crumble around you in an instant. It sucks, and it's not a good feeling, but it doesn't make you a bad person because you couldn't figure a way out of it. It happens. It's part of being a business owner.

    Now, try and put yourself in another persons shoes and show a little compassion. I'm just trying to help some people make sense of this. It's unfortunate for everyone involved, but it is what it is. This is my opinion and nothing more. You don't have to agree or disagree. I'd prefer not to get any hate mail over this but do what you must.
    Well, he may have "INTENDED" to do the right thing(s), but his actions have proven him not too.

    Whats the old saying, "The road to hell is lined with good intentions." We may judge ourselves and our close friends by our intentions, but it is our ACTIONS that judge us, because our actions are proof of what we really have done and accomplished.

    While what you have stated is passionate, and demonstrates a good heart on your behalf, it is no defense for your friend whatsoever.

    He failed to communicate to people that entrusted him with their bikes and their money.

    He avoided them by deception, and flat out running away.

    He has not made one step towards rectifying these situations.

    His actions have judged him as dishonest, cowardly, and thievery.

    I am curious, how would you feel if your friend took your bike and hard earned cash, and treated you just the same as the "faceless/nameless" folk he took advantage of?

    The truth is, your friend is a liar and a thief. If you truly are a friend, you would confront him to his face, tell him there is no excuse this side of he and.his entire family being killed in plane crash, that would justify this deplorable and despicable behavior, and he NEEDS to do the right thing, and if not, your friendship is over with him. But thats what I would do. Its up to you to either stand for integrity, or to simply become a sycophant for a friends indefensible behavior.

    I feel really sorry for everyone that got ripped off here.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by toxiceric View Post
    Well, I'm going to chime in here and I'm sure, be labeled as a co-conspiritor, but whatever. For those of you that love nothing better than to bash someone and make it a point to get everyone on your side without ever hearing the other guys side, I'm sure you won't care, but, here it is.

    I won't drag this out, but Rich is NOT a crook. Like so many others in this industry that have actual full time shops, he was unable to keep it going for multiple reasons. The most important being the health of a family member. He had to close his shop to take care of someone who fell ill earlier this year. Other things happened as well. Things out of anyones control. I'm not going to tell the whole story, as it's not my place, but I do consider Rich to be a friend and there are many half truths being told here. I'm sure no one cares, but there it is.

    He is trying to make things right with people a little at a time. Perhaps, if you tried being kind and showed the tiniest bit of understanding, you might get somewhere with this. Making demands and getting in someones face and bashing them anywhere someone will listen doesn't help. Just curious, when's the last time someone got in your face about something and you actually felt like helping them? Hmmm? More so, if someone demands something from you, i.e. money, and you don't have it, where exactly should you get it? People have lost their homes over circumstances beyond their control.

    Here's the bottom line. Unless you have been self employed with a full time business, and I'm not talking about a home based whatever, you don't understand what it takles to keep a business going and how it can all crumble around you in an instant. It sucks, and it's not a good feeling, but it doesn't make you a bad person because you couldn't figure a way out of it. It happens. It's part of being a business owner.

    Now, try and put yourself in another persons shoes and show a little compassion. I'm just trying to help some people make sense of this. It's unfortunate for everyone involved, but it is what it is. This is my opinion and nothing more. You don't have to agree or disagree. I'd prefer not to get any hate mail over this but do what you must.
    Actually, here's the bottom line. When you're a grown ass man, you either do what you say you're gonna do or you give everyone their money and their shit back and hope they forgive you. What it takes to keep a business afloat is totally irrelevant. Dodging someone calls and not staying in contact after taking their money and bike isn't respectable in any way. If it were my shit, i would've already gone and taken it back personally. Maybe this guy could use his $4,000 for his own fucking family? What a fucking genius thought that might have been. And a news flash for you, in the real world, when you're fucking with my shit and my money you don't get the courtesy of my "compassion".

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by toxiceric View Post
    Well, I'm going to chime in here and I'm sure, be labeled as a co-conspiritor, but whatever. For those of you that love nothing better than to bash someone and make it a point to get everyone on your side without ever hearing the other guys side, I'm sure you won't care, but, here it is.

    I won't drag this out, but Rich is NOT a crook. Like so many others in this industry that have actual full time shops, he was unable to keep it going for multiple reasons. The most important being the health of a family member. He had to close his shop to take care of someone who fell ill earlier this year. Other things happened as well. Things out of anyones control. I'm not going to tell the whole story, as it's not my place, but I do consider Rich to be a friend and there are many half truths being told here. I'm sure no one cares, but there it is.

    He is trying to make things right with people a little at a time. Perhaps, if you tried being kind and showed the tiniest bit of understanding, you might get somewhere with this. Making demands and getting in someones face and bashing them anywhere someone will listen doesn't help. Just curious, when's the last time someone got in your face about something and you actually felt like helping them? Hmmm? More so, if someone demands something from you, i.e. money, and you don't have it, where exactly should you get it? People have lost their homes over circumstances beyond their control.

    Here's the bottom line. Unless you have been self employed with a full time business, and I'm not talking about a home based whatever, you don't understand what it takles to keep a business going and how it can all crumble around you in an instant. It sucks, and it's not a good feeling, but it doesn't make you a bad person because you couldn't figure a way out of it. It happens. It's part of being a business owner.

    Now, try and put yourself in another persons shoes and show a little compassion. I'm just trying to help some people make sense of this. It's unfortunate for everyone involved, but it is what it is. This is my opinion and nothing more. You don't have to agree or disagree. I'd prefer not to get any hate mail over this but do what you must.
    1) I was very understanding, for the first year or so. If you saw the emails that I have saved you would see where I go from being understanding to down right pissed. I think I have every reason to be angry waiting 4 years now.

    2) He took responsibility and cared for a family member, I respect that.... Now get in line with the rest of us that have had to make unbelievable sacrifices for family. And you say his problems compiled from there.... damn the bad luck, I guess you think my problems only happen one at a time and stack themselves in nice neat rows for me to deal with. Suck it up buttercup, you are under the impression that your friend's problems are greater than the rest of ours. You have no clue.

    3) I have never had anyone shove anger in my face the way people have to Richard, then again I have never conducted myself the way Mr. Ford has. I bet it is an unpleasant experience, but it is deserved.

    4) I am self-employed, my work brings me all over the world, sometimes I am gone for 8 or more months a year. If I ever failed the way Mr. Ford has the consequences would be far greater, so do not preach to me about "what it takes" and it is certainly not "part of being a business owner".

    5) I will not put myself in Mr. Ford's shoes anymore; I did that in the beginning. I kept doing that to the point where he closed up his shop and dropped off the face of the earth.

    6) You're standing by your friends side and I respect that, no matter how jacked up I think it may be you have the sand to stand next to him and that is very rare.

    Here is my bottom line, the money and property he took delivery of needs to be returned. I can't speak for the others but I would not want to send him anymore money for "completed" projects.

  6. #46
    toxiceric
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    Whatever. I wasn't preaching, just letting some people know what was going on. I didn't say anyone should just "suck it up", and I'm not saying I wouldn't be upset too, but what are you going to do? Just keep hating on this guy and not letting it go?Even if you sued him, if he doesn't have the money, where should it come from?

    And, as to the "how would I feel?", I'll tell you. I got fucked for $15K by a "friend". Am I pissed? Of course I am. Have I let it go? Fuck yeah. Otherwise, he wins. Then he got my money AND my sanity. I'm not giving him both. And I was straight fucked, not the victim of some shit gone wrong. He planned it. Rich on the other hand, got in over his head and then it all fell apart. You can't give people money you don't have. He had his business for something like 15 years. Do you suppose he stayed in business for years by fucking people? Or, do you really think he just planned it all out for 15 years just to fuck a few people for a few thousand bucks? Thats pretty bad planning if you believe that.

    Honestly, is there not one person among you who has held on to something, believeing you could save it and then had it come apart at the seams? If not, then I guess you're all just perfect people that never make mistakes. I wish I was, but the reality is that not everyone handles a crisis like the next guy. It's always easier to look in the rear view and see where things went wrong, but it's not always that clear when you're knee deep in it.

    I'm a third party and in no way involved. I was just trying to put things in perspective as a third party like lots of other people have done that don't even have both sides of the story. I'm not trying to upset anyone. I was just hoping it might help. My mistake if it didn't. I'll stay out of this and let you guys handle it however you see fit.
    Last edited by toxiceric; 08-26-2013 at 7:22 PM.

  7. #47

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    There is that old saying never take another mans bike or old lady!!!! Unless you want to pick your teeth up with broken fingers!!! Lol

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnnychaz View Post
    There is that old saying never take another mans bike or old lady!!!! Unless you want to pick your teeth up with broken fingers!!! Lol

    Why the hell are you resurrecting a nearly 4 year old dead thread to make a smart ass comment that doesn't even pertain to the situation?

  9. #49

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    Just happened on this thread of course 5 years late. Did everyone re-coop the money they paid him?

  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by strike6 View Post
    Just happened on this thread of course 5 years late. Did everyone re-coop the money they paid him?
    It's actually been 10 YEARS, this month.
    A few years back, Rich Ford claimed he would own up, pay for the bike & the $4,000 I sent him. He promised monthly checks to reimburse me.
    He sent me a money order for $250 & I never heard from him again.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by donmillerx View Post
    It's actually been 10 YEARS, this month.
    A few years back, Rich Ford claimed he would own up, pay for the bike & the $4,000 I sent him. He promised monthly checks to reimburse me.
    He sent me a money order for $250 & I never heard from him again.
    Hmm, sounds to me like you need to just let it go and have some compassion for the man's misfortunes.

  12. #52
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    G&L has been long gone... same as acme choppers and all the other fly by night shops.

  13. #53

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    Easy for you to say.
    I doubt you'd have any "compassion."

    Will you give me $4k and one of YOUR bikes then?

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by donmillerx View Post
    Easy for you to say.
    I doubt you'd have any "compassion."

    Will you give me $4k and one of YOUR bikes then?
    Sarcasm my dude, I would literally be hunting the guy down with a satellite right now if I was in your position. Was poking fun at the guy a few pages back

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