Need some help picking a lathe and mill

[JBinNC]

As far as moving heavy shit keep in mind the egyptians built the pyramids with nothing more than desire to please the pharaoh. a little fore thought and some old forktubes can move some heavy ass shit.

And a whip.

Jim

[Hubbard]

Oh yeah... Totally agree.

I see brands like Clausing, and they look very good. Obviously not production machines.. For a couple thousand bucks. It's absolutely lousy with Bridgeports. Surface grinders. Power hones. Anything you want!

Something has clearly changed, and changed a lot.

I dunno what, exactly? I am suspecting a generation gap.

I'm GenX and some of my generation, and most of every generation which came before, had a basic understanding of how things worked and basic skills which were almost imputed from one generation to the next. This was true even if they didn't use them daily.

My father was an engineer. But he could do plumbing. He built a garage. He could do roofing. Upgrade the service in the house. Etc.

That is not the case now.

While there are a good number of very talented GenM and Z people out there, more are not and couldn't care less. Even if they did care? They lack the prerequisite skills necessary to make learning things like this hobby easy for them.

That is my theory, anyway. The evidence is anecdotal, but it seems to hold true thus far.

cell phones and facebook will wipe out an entire generation of people . think I'm wrong? next time you're in a crowd of people look around.I bet in 15 years babies will be born with their heads tilted toward their chest.

[confab]

Interesting that you mention generational change. That concerns me very much, actually. Not just the lack of ability and chopper skill, but the void of ignorance about basic things that accompanies it.

Much can be said about the Boomers, and a lot is. It has even become a term of derision among the internet GenM's and Z's. "Okay Boomer"

Like that.

It is an attempt to paint the entire generation of boomers as backward and unable to understand the high tech nature of the world we live in today.

But if there's one thing I have learned about the boomer generation, it is that you can't fuck them on a deal. They won't let you.

You propose something stupid and they just know too much to fall for it. They know how the electricity arrives at the switch. They know how the water gets into the house and out of it again. They know they have to commute to work, and what a silly idea will do to them on a weekly basis. They understand inflation and why too much of it is very, very bad. I could go on and on about this, but it is sufficient to say that they know a lot about the world around them and how things work. Their calculus is measured in the gas tank and on the dinner table.
It is hard to fuck them over because of this.

I do not see this level of recognition about basic things among large segments of the Gen M and Z population.

Their mindset is almost revolutionary and when you couple that with sheer ignorance of the type I touched on above? I'm concerned about a future with them running it.

[confab]

And PS: A bunch of that slick, new, high tech stuff? Isn't really new tech at all.

It is old tech that programmable logic gave a slick, new interface. So it looks much more revolutionary than it really is.

[Hubbard]

could any of this have to do with the fact that us boomers didn't spend every waking hour trying to get noticed on a chinese communication toy? I spent my childhood making models and building other shit using my imagination as a tool. From what I have seen from the new crowd at work they have no imagination whatsoever.

[confab]

could any of this have to do with the fact that us boomers didn't spend every waking hour trying to get noticed on a chinese communication toy? I spent my childhood making models and building other shit using my imagination as a tool. From what I have seen from the new crowd at work they have no imagination whatsoever.

I think that's kind of the root of it, actually.

IMO, previous generations spent their time doing real things. Some out of necessity, (I'm the last generation that unloaded coal from a pickup truck with a shovel to heat dad's house) and some of it for leisure. But, very little of it was mindless. It required some degree of thought. Previous generations seemed better with reading and comprehension. Better attention spans. Maybe this is a byproduct of being raised in the print age?

The world was different also. The Soviet Union was a major force in world politics and it had a dramatic effect on our domestic politics also.

I think it was just harder to have your head up your ass then, generally.

[SaddleTramp98]

As I said, i've been looking at larger machines lately and I will get shunned and have my man card taken away for saying this, but the truth is - I also have a Chinese mini lathe and I like it a lot. I've done a ton of stuff with it.

The powerfeed makes for a nice finish. It takes the patience of a saint to use it, but it was new. It plug into any outlet I want. I've made some really, really nice parts for my bike with it and I did it with carbide index tooling from Amazon and Harbor Freight that the real machinists say isn't good for small machines like mine. It is a larger one (7x14) and most of what I want to do or tune fits in it. They do threading.

I wish I had bought a slightly bigger one (like a 16 or a 20 inch) with power crossfeed now, but that's it. I won't get rid of it if I buy a bigger machine because it is just too handy and the proportional speed control makes it fabulous. I have no other regrets about buying it. It is perfect.

There's a kid on youtube named "Tim Nummy" who isn't a machinist either, and he does a lot with one.. Including motorcycle stuff, if you want to see someone new really use and modify one of these on the cheap. It may be edifying?

Good luck, bro! Let us know what you end up doing! This kind of stuff fascinates me.

There's nothing wrong with having chinese/budget tools in my eyes (I do stay far away from the bargain tools you find at flea markets however like those super cheap screwdriver sets in the plastic with like 25 drivers for $10) I have tons of harbor freight stuff and mostly stuff I inherited from my grandpa. (Some snap on, Craftsman, also lots of HF tools) so I was lucky as far as hand tools go he was a Trucker and a hobby auto mechanic/car flipper so he had the basic stuff like socket sets and ratchets, wrenches, etc. Anyway its what you do with the tools you have that matters, though ik tools have they're limits. That's why I'm trying to start with something nice and sturdy to give me a little edge.

I saw you posted about that "Tim Nummy" dude. I was watching his video about the cheap mini mill last night before making this thread.

I will keep this updated if I can find the time to go pick it up. He said delivery in his post but I should probably go inspect it before forking over the cash for it without testing it. And see about some tooling.

[SaddleTramp98]

Unfortunately the lathe has been sold, he just didnt have the listing removed. I learned some stuff from this thread and I'll keep my eye out for one. No rush anyway. My uncle is a machinist and I'll ask him if he can keep his eye out for a mill and a lathe if he hears of one coming up for sale. I'll update if I spot anything that catches my eye.

[SaddleTramp98]

Alright guy's, I've found a 6x18 Atlas lathe, it looks like it comes with, a tool post ( not quick change) I saw some cutting tools/ tooling, a 4 jaw chuck, has the tail stock, some thread cutting gears I think, and it has some other tools that I'm not familiar with. Here's some pics of them? I







He wants $1000 is that a fair price or what should I offer him? Or should I hold out for a larger one?

[confab]

The clamp things are for turning on center, I think. There's a rest. Price should be commensurate with condition, and that is probably on the higher end in this market. Here and for 1k? It should be very nice.

As far as the size, it depends on what you're doing. You can figure on losing several inches of bed length by the time you load a live center and actually go to work.

Personally? I think it is a good size. I wouldn't want something over about 24 or 30 inches because they take up too much space. But that's just me.

Think about the power and if you want a Variable Frequency Drive also..


Good luck!

[DustyDave]

I would think that's about twice what such a small lathe with out a quick change gear box would be worth to me.
Dusty

[SaddleTramp98]

I would think that's about twice what such a small lathe with out a quick change gear box would be worth to me.
Dusty

Yeah I dont know much about maching or tooling and stuff but I think I'll wait it out for a 9x13 with some more features and comes with tooling, unless this guy wants to go down on the price. Also hes kinda way outta my way. Thanks for the opinions! I'm in no rush to buy, I need to save anyway. I just like to ask in case I'm missing out on a good deal.

[Hubbard]

3 times what its worth. and for someone starting out wrong machine. no quick change gear box for a novice is a no-no. find a south bend with a quick change like the 1st one you posted. without a quick change every thread pitch or feed speed takes a different gear that has to be calculated and installed. I have an atlas,built many scooters on it. the south bend will run all over it. and keep asking questions, thats the diff. between a broke fool and a successful person.

[golfish]

This thread survived: http://www.chopcult.com/forum/showthread.php?t=49394

Machine tool prices are highly regional so be happy when ya live where the early variety are long obsolete for production. My bros WWII era American Pacemakers make him money every week because of their size but the small manual stuff isn't profitable enough to keep except for specialty toolroom lathes and much of it doesn't spin fast enough for modern tooling in production use where time is money.

OTOH I live in the Southeast which never industrialized except in a few small areas and prices remain silly though we did well scoring during the last recession.

Re shelving and benches, it's worth making the benches roll tool (wood prices are silly these days but steel remains reasonable, get multiple quotes when buying new). If everything that touches the floor is mobile it makes life much more convenient. Shelves work better with lips so mine are upward-facing angle with plywood inside (you can have steel sheared to size where it's worthwhile).

Study how machine shops store tooling, which is usually on carts near the machine. Also note typical practice for power is drops from the ceiling (add outlet then use a drop or a cord reel as ya like). SOOW cord is typical for drops. Refer to electricians for advanced info.

Keep an eye out for used forklift jacks. They're easy to rebuild and the very common OTC style works great for machinery. Ya can rent them if ya need one immediately.

I'm so enviros of you guys the know how to use these machines and then can afford to set them up.

Kudos to all of you..





I wish

[rockman96]

They just had an on-line auction where I work... They sold a Jet 13x36 lathe which went for $820. It made me sick. I've used that very lathe a good bit over the years, and someone got a hella deal. I wanted to bid on it so bad just because of the thought, but I have no where to keep another lathe and I have a 5 year old Grizzly 14x40.

One piece of advice I will give to anyone looking to purchase a machine (lathe, mill, it goes for everything) is to try to procure as much tooling as possible with the aquisition. If you're buying new, its a moot point, but lots of times you can score big buying used.The machine itself will be your minimal cash outlay in the grand scheme of things, you will end up with much more invested in tooling than the machine itself 10 years down the road.
One other thing... go as big as you can possibly go. Make room for it, borrow some extra money if you have to. You can do tiny shit on a big machine, but you can only do small stuff on a small machine. Plus the bigger machine will cut faster, and make better cuts with fewer passes.