Weird starting issue question

[misfitJason]

Bike info:
Custom built softail
V111 motor
Ultimate six speed trans
All balls 1.4kw starter
Automotive start button and starter solenoid button
Bdl open 3 inch primary


I have been having an issue with starting ever since I put the new motor in the bike. I thought it was my acr’s not functioning but they seem un-related. When I hit the automotive start button or solenoid starter button the engine turns over and stalls for a second or two, then it will spin again.

The battery voltage drops to seven bolts when it does this. And it does this regardless of the battery that’s hooked up to it. I have tried three other batteries (2 new ones and a know good one out of my Dyna). The voltage drop is the same with all of them.

I pulled the stator rotor and checked for any type of binding on the engine case with negative results.

If it matters it does more of a stall cold rather than hot. My battery cables are in good condition and are the nice bendable terry components ones. Also I have a secondary ground cable going to the starter bolt, which didn’t and doesn’t make any difference. Any ideas gentlemen?

[Revelator]

your 1.4kw starter may have all it's Balls, But those Balls may not be big enough.
How many cubes is the motor & Do You know what compression ratio it is?
1.4kw is okay for stock motor, But not much else.

Battery Connections >make sure they are all tight.

Could even be something binding on the starter mechanism, Ring or pinion
gears, or something out of alignment. Was the same starter used on your old engine?

[JBinNC]

Try it with the plugs out. If it does the same thing, I'm guessing you have a starter problem. If it spins freely and the battery voltage stays above 10V, that suggests that your compression releases are not functioning properly.

FYI, I use a starter relay wired in parallel with the normal starter relay to power the compression releases. 12V power to both relays from the main breaker, not through any switch.

Jim

[Revelator]

It could also be the heavy copper contacts om the starter solenoid, They
can get dirty & pitted, which causes resistance & will cause the same symptom you
described. Easy enough to check them, just pull off the end cap & slide the parts out (carefully)
some of them have a steel ball that slides into the hole & rides against a spring.
then inspect the copper contacts they will be easy to see, There should be two of them bolted
to the housing with isolators, & 3rd contact (circular) on the solenoid that you slide out the end.
look for pitting & excessive black soot build up. if they don't look good take a photo and put it up.

[Bbqbiker]

I had same issue with S&S V124 Motor. Added All Balls starter when motor was installed and was reluctant to start...same as yours. Called S&S and they said use stock starter...the aftermarket pulls too much current to allow ACR’s to function properly. Put in stock starter along with new sumax heavy gauge battery cables, and all is good. After bumping compression to 11:3-1 added compufire lower ratio ring gear in primary and largest CCA battery that would fit. All good for years now

[misfitJason]

your 1.4kw starter may have all it's Balls, But those Balls may not be big enough.
How many cubes is the motor & Do You know what compression ratio it is?
1.4kw is okay for stock motor, But not much else.

Battery Connections >make sure they are all tight.

Could even be something binding on the starter mechanism, Ring or pinion
gears, or something out of alignment. Was the same starter used on your old engine?

I was thinking of the binding issue. The starter I put in a month before I got the new motor and all grounds are tight and good.

[misfitJason]

Try it with the plugs out. If it does the same thing, I'm guessing you have a starter problem. If it spins freely and the battery voltage stays above 10V, that suggests that your compression releases are not functioning properly.

FYI, I use a starter relay wired in parallel with the normal starter relay to power the compression releases. 12V power to both relays from the main breaker, not through any switch.

Jim

I will try it with the plugs out. The starter relay is wired in parallel with the starter relay. Even if I manually push and activate the releases it still stalls out.

[misfitJason]

It could also be the heavy copper contacts om the starter solenoid, They
can get dirty & pitted, which causes resistance & will cause the same symptom you
described. Easy enough to check them, just pull off the end cap & slide the parts out (carefully)
some of them have a steel ball that slides into the hole & rides against a spring.
then inspect the copper contacts they will be easy to see, There should be two of them bolted
to the housing with isolators, & 3rd contact (circular) on the solenoid that you slide out the end.
look for pitting & excessive black soot build up. if they don't look good take a photo and put it up.

The relay is new and I just wired it up when I put the motor in. Like I said before it does it regardless of me using the automotive button wired up to the realy or just the starter solenoid button which is direct to the starter.

[misfitJason]

I had same issue with S&S V124 Motor. Added All Balls starter when motor was installed and was reluctant to start...same as yours. Called S&S and they said use stock starter...the aftermarket pulls too much current to allow ACR’s to function properly. Put in stock starter along with new sumac cables, and all is good. After bumping compression to 11:3-1 added compufire lower ratio ring gear in primary and largest CCA battery that would fit. All good for years now

This is an excellent Idea and I still have my stock starter motor to install back in to try.

[misfitJason]

Well, I have always thought my acrs didn’t function properly since I bought the motor new. I ordered up some new ones to replace the old ones. When I got the new ones they were super easy to depress and sprung back up very easily. When I took the old ones out...,,,,,see video

https://youtu.be/F0giF3AX_Xg

[farmall]

I'd slice one open with a zip disk to see what's inside and maybe learn why it failed.