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  1. #21
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    Chapter 6: The Power of One Part

    Anyone who has been doing this for a while knows how much influence one part can have. I'm not necessarily talking about big parts like a Ness digger frame, or a sweet Panhead motor. It's little stuff like a seat, or a taillight. Sometimes guys build whole bikes around such a part. Other times it'll change the direction of a build, right in the middle. This is about one such part and the change that goes with it. Not a major change, but not minor either. I'll let you judge the degree, I'll just tell the story.

    I was at about the point where you saw this last, up in post #19, when I was checking out the classifieds on the JJ. Someone had offered up a Servicar lower tree. It got me to thinking. I remembered having seen an upper Servicar/Sidecar tree on eBay in the previous couple of days. It had a set of T bars welded to it, and was going pretty cheap. Sure enough, it was still there. Not long before this, I had talked to a guy who was riding a late '70's FLH with sidecar trees in the raked position. It had a little different look to it, subtle but different. I liked it. He said it handled fine, but I was still a little leery about the reduced trail. I've never been in a tank slapping speed wobble, and if you guys don't mind, I'll just skip that rite of passage into "real" bikerhood.

    But... What if you added a little more rake to the frame, say with 3° cups? And maybe added a little more overall rake by running 4" or 6" over fork tubes and maybe dropping it a little in the rear? I had a set of cups I'd bought when I was thinking about deraking the Paughco frame this engine came in just a little. I had a set of 4" over tubes and a set of 9" over I could cut down. Why not? So I made a deal with the JJ seller and put a bid into the sniping program I use on eBay and sat back.

    At this point the story turns a little sour. I got outbid on the top tree. The lower tree took 3 weeks to get to me, and when it did, there were issues. I'll take all the blame on the top tree. Did I mention I'm a cheapskate? I'm only gonna take part of the blame on the lower. Yes, I should have looked closer at the pics, but it was on the boards, and not eBay or Craigslist, and I felt safer. The seller could have disclosed some of the stuff in the description. But fixing blame isn't going to fix the problem.

    What's the saying? When life hands you lemons, make lemonade. Or Gin, lemon, 7. Well, the combination of me, gin, and riding isn't a good one so let's call it lemonade. Here's my lemonade kit:

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    You can see on the stem part that the fork stops are cut away, and on the fork tube clamp part that the cowbell tabs were cut off and rewelded. What you can't see is that the fork stem threads were not so hot, or that there was just a little movement between the parts when they were bolted together lightly. I couldn't move them by hand when they were tight, but I'm sure the forces and weight of the bike could have.

    The two discs in the pic are there to hold the center part of the top tree perpendicular to the stem while the rest of it gets bent. The idea was to cut a semi-circle into the top tree, leaving just a little attachment at each end, then heat and bend the upper 'til the lower lined up. I assembled it with a set of fork tubes in it, to keep everything straight. Since the bolt won't go into the hole with fork tubes in position, I made up a couple locating pins that would (not shown.)

    Here's the finished parts, bent top tree, added fork stops, and the two pieces of the lower tree welded together. The cut on the top tree was made in a mill, on a rotary table. This is a pic that I took to print out and take to the powdercoater with the parts. I mark on the printout where things need to be masked and stuff like that with a sharpie, and it usually comes back right. It's also why there are bolts in the threaded parts.

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    And here's the way it sits, 3° cups, raked trees (about another 4°,) 4" over fork tubes and slightly shorter shocks in the rear.

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  2. #22
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    Have you decided on a rear fender yet????????

  3. #23
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    Chapter 6a: The Power of One Part (Can't Remember Everything)

    I forgot one thing when I was showing you guys the mod above. I had read a while back about someone who didn't trust the 3° cups. He thought they might shift in the frame and cause a problem. In my case they went in pretty tight, and they were knurled, but why not add an extra layer of stability. The bolts I used were just long enough to protrude a little into the bore of the neck cups, and I had to take a die grinder to the excess as the bore is pretty tight on those 3° cups. One bolt in, and here's tapping the other hole:

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  4. #24
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    Those set screws are good insurance and easy to paint over so they won't rust. They'll be near invisible.

  5. #25
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    What if you could use one of those bolts to go all the way through and machine out the steering stem to act as an internal fork stop?? Idk if it'd be strong enough but just a thought.


    Probably a bit too sketchy the more I think about it..

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atellez View Post
    What if you could use one of those bolts to go all the way through and machine out the steering stem to act as an internal fork stop?? Idk if it'd be strong enough but just a thought.


    Probably a bit too sketchy the more I think about it..
    I don't think I would attempt it........

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tattooo View Post
    Have you decided on a rear fender yet????????
    Yes, some time ago. I haven't moved the rest of the thread over yet, so we're still a ways from real time. I'll bet I tried every fender I had on this bike, stepped back and looked. Here's a pic of one that didn't make the cut.

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    From a (best) forgotten chapter in Fender history, a series of acoustics made in Santa Ana CA from the mid '60's to the early '70's. They weren't well received, and didn't sell well. The Fender loyalists didn't want acoustics, and the acoustic fans thought that the Fenders just didn't have that great "sound" you'd expect from a name manufacturer. This particular one, a Newporter, proves the adage, "Just because it's rare doesn't mean it's valuable, or collectible." If you watch YouTube videos of '60s country TV shows, you'll occasionally see one.

  8. #28
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    LOL ^^^^^^^^ Now that's very cool......^^^^^^^^^^^^

  9. #29
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    Hahaha ...

    Watch those curves !!

    .../// https://youtu.be/BvLtNBm1yyA \\\...

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tattooo View Post
    I don't think I would attempt it........
    Nor I. I can picture the overloaded screw snapping off (threads are stress raisers) and jamming between cup and stem while deforming the cup enough to require a drill to remove it, and drilling hardened screws gets old quick.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atellez View Post
    What if you could use one of those bolts to go all the way through and machine out the steering stem to act as an internal fork stop?? Idk if it'd be strong enough but just a thought.


    Probably a bit too sketchy the more I think about it..
    I don't think I would either. There are simpler ways to have hidden fork stops, if that's what you're after.

  12. #32
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    Chapter 7: I'll Come Up With a Chapter Title Later

    It had been a while since I had posted on the original build thread, and someone PM'd me and told me he had posted to the thread, speculating what may be taking me so long. His post was deleted. So I had to be my own apologist.

    I'm slow, evidenced by the fact that I'm about 5 years into this build. It's the reason I've never worked as a mechanic/technician. I'm good enough, just not fast enough at it to make any money.

    Here's a list of reasons (OK, excuses,) that I'm slow.
    ~I lack ambition. (This is a lifelong failing. I remember the teachers in grade school telling my parents "He could do so much better if he'd only apply himself.")
    ~I'm easily distracted.
    ~I'm fickle, and keep changing my mind about stuff.
    ~I have poor time management skills.
    ~I'm not well organized.
    ~I'm a procrastinator. (see chapter title.)
    There are probably more that I've forgotten... Oh yeah,
    ~I'm forgetful.

    Here's an example of how this comes around to bite me sometimes. I had cleaned up the transmission and was ready to bolt it into the frame, so I went looking around my garage for the hardware. I was specifically looking for a bag or pile of hardware that contained the two carriage bolts with one side of the head ground flush with one of the flats underneath. Over a couple of days I looked for about 3-4 hours.

    It wasn't all just searching. For example I was looking on one of the shelves where I keep stuff for this build. I decided to clean off the shelf while I was at it, and put away the stuff there I knew I wasn't gonna use. While I was putting something away in the box with the oil tank parts, filters and lines, I came across an oil tank cap and wondered if it would fit the barrel tank I intended to put on my next build Panhead. It didn't, but almost, so I thought I'd measure the threads to see if it was the wrong count or just bunged threads. Wrong count, but it came to mind there there was a box of brass plumbing fittings. I dug in there and found one that did fit, and with a little work will make a great one-off oil tank cap for a different motorcycle from the one I'm working on now.

    It eventually came to me to go look at the frame from which I'd removed this transmission. I found that it had been bolted to a Panhead style transmission mount plate and that the hardware I remembered and was looking for was for the last shovelhead I had worked on and sold the previous spring.

    So I sat down with the parts book and a pencil and paper, and in less that 10 minutes, had a list of what I needed. Between shopping in my own hardware dept. and an $8 trip to the hardware store, I had everything I would need. There was a mounting stud that had come out of the trans when I unbolted it, (still don't know where that is,) but fortunately I had a new one in my stash-o-stuff.

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    This is a '65 up style of transmission mounting plate. If you've seen these before, you may notice that this particular one has 3 extra holes, (two are pretty small, ¼ x 20) in the floor of the plate. This is an 82 or later 4 speed plate to which mounts the bracket for the spin-on oil filter. The filter is the one they used on '80-e'84 Sportsters and '82-'86 four speed Shovelhead and Evo, but not Softails. The filter is smaller, both in diameter and shorter, than the more common Evo filter. It even had a smaller thread, ⅝" as opposed to the Evo's ¾".

    The ¼" holes are for the clips to keep the oil lines from drooping. You might notice the pinch clamps, and the pliers. The top pair are what most people use, and even what McMaster Carr sells for pinch clamp pliers. I'm not sure where I got the bottom pair, but not only do they pinch the clamp. they flatten the pinched tab down at the same time. (someone asked about them so I searched and found Lisle 30800. They're similar but updated and allow operation with a torque wrench for use on CV boots.)

    I like an oil filter that's tucked away better than one that hangs out in front or on the side almost like a design feature. It's personal taste and goes with my design philosophy "You can't go wrong with clean and simple."

    Here's a pic of the plate all bolted into the frame. Don't do this!

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    You can't bolt the mount plate to the frame and then bolt the trans to it. You must loosely bolt the plate to the trans and slide it in from the side for the primary ears on the trans case to clear the swingarm pivot. This the first time I've ever made this mistake and I'd probably forget about this time too if I hadn't just posted about it, with pictures.

    And here's the trans in the frame. The end cover is only on loosely. It needs a lightweight polish and some throwout parts (if I didn't throw them out accidentally.)

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  13. #33
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    Chapter 8: Boring Stuff and Small Surprises.

    How boring is bolting in the oil tank, temporarily, so you can figure what to do about a rear fender? It's temporary because I haven't decided yet if I want 25 year old chrome with a few acid spots, black either in powder or paint, or to paint the thing to match the sheet metal, which will not be black.

    But even then, working on this stuff hands you surprises. For example, I have no idea why the oil tank mounting block on the frame's seatpost was tapped 7/16-14 instead of the 5/16-24 it left the factory with. It was an easy problem to solve, I just drilled out the bracket and made another $1 trip to the hardware store.

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    I also got another pleasant surprise while I was chasing the threads on that, just for good measure.

    I have a lot of tools. Too many in fact. At the time I had maybe 50# worth of surplus tools in toolboxes, buckets, and sturdy cardboard boxes stacked by my compressor. I eventually sold them as a lot, to a flea market vendor. It started with all the tools I had acquired (and continue to acquire.) on my own. Then about 30 years ago my dad passed away and I inherited all of his tools. His were much nicer than mine, most of 'em anyway, and well cared for. He was the kind of guy who lined the toolbox drawers with felt before he laid the tools neatly in them. When I borrowed his tools, he'd get them out of his locked box for me, and when I brought them back, they had to be clean.

    About 15 years ago I hooked up with my current OL. She's a widow and her late husband was a fix anything, flea market buying, tool collecting, pack rat sort of a guy. Now I have all of his tools as well. The surprise probably came out of his stash.

    It's a Craftsman ratcheting tap wrench. I had never seen one before, or even knew they existed. I normally tap or chase threads with a long handled tap wrench, but this application called for the "T" type. I pulled it out of the drawer because it was the right size, and didn't know it was ratcheting 'til I was putting the tap in it. In fact I didn't notice it was ratcheting when I used it for an earlier picture on the neck cup lock bolts. (It's not the wrench I actually tapped those holes with.)

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  14. #34
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    Chapter 9 Louie's Smoke Break

    The guy I worked for at an indy shop 20+ years ago had a brother who built and raced a Funny Car. Brother Louie once told me that guys who smoke cigarettes tend to be more successful at racing. He went on to explain that, while working on the cars, smokers take smoke breaks during which they look at where they are and think about where they're going. They come up with more and better ideas while smoking than they would just plowing ahead. This, of course, applies to building bikes too.

    I don't smoke, never did, and I'm certainly not advocating that anyone start. But you can still take a break once in a while. Have a beer, cup of coffee, or a Pepsi. Push the bike outside and sit down in a chair and look at it while you do. Or you can take a picture of it, stare at it on your computer screen. If you can do the same thing looking at it on that tiny little screen you carry around in your pocket, (I can't) do that.

    Here's a totally unrelated pic to contemplate for now, 'til the next update:

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    Not too long ago, I heard that Louie had passed, down in Fla. RIP Louie, and thanks.

  15. #35
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    Chapter 10: All This Is Behind Me.

    I had a breakthrough the other day. I think the OL is buying the cheap toilet paper again. But you'd rather hear about this motorcycle up on my table.

    I really have been working in the garage. I've been working on the oil tank cap (for another bike) I mentioned a few posts back. I've been working on my sandblast cabinet, hooking up a shop vac and setting it up so I can soda blast in there too. I've been working on rebuilding a caliper, also probably not for this bike. I've been working on a headlight/bracket deal for this bike, pics and details to come once it gets farther along. And I've been working on the rear fender, which is the subject today.

    Do I mount the fender to the frame, in a more or less normal way, or do I mount it directly to the swingarm? Here was my stare at and study pic for mounting it to the swingarm.

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    That particular fender was marketed as a front, and it was supposed to come with brackets to attach it to the fork. Somehow, that one showed up at the shop where I worked without them. I can't remember if we got a refund or another fender, but the boss told me I could have that one. Problem was, it didn't work with either of the seat set-ups I wanted to use, so I figured i'd mount the fender to the frame.

    I thought I'd try this way:

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    This was an inspirational pic I saved from somewhere. I like it a lot. But in my file of 475 or so images of swingarm bikes there are maybe a half a dozen other bikes with a very similar setup that seem to miss the mark. I cut up the fender that I got with this bike and tried it, along with a repop rear section for a hinged rigid fender I had, and I couldn't get either one to look "just right" either. Maybe it's the paint, or the wheel, or the angle of the pic, or all of the above.

    To shorten a long story, this is what I ended up going with:

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    There are several things to notice in this pic. Of course, the fender, a standard FX fender that's been trimmed. I haven't painted it yet, and may likely go with farmall's suggestion about the rolled bead on the edge. I have a bobbed pre-unit swingarm Triumph fender that's been done that way, all in brass, and it looks really good. The struts in the pic are from B&C.

    Other things include the LePera seat with the basket weave top, a swap meet find. The taillight is from a '38 Studebaker. The tank divider was a flea market pick. I thought it would make a good tank divider for fatbobs. Then about a week later I saw another one just like it on TV. On NCIS New Orleans, there it was, on the nose of a horse that was pulling a carriage in the French Quarter.

    One more pic, profiling the bottom of the taillight so it fits the fender. I first did some rough grinding on the wheel. This step is the coarse paper spray glued to another section of FX fender.

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  16. #36
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    Looks much better with the B&C struts than the other options and that fender is long enough to be useful.

    I have a bobbed pre-unit swingarm Triumph fender that's been done that way, all in brass, and it looks really good.
    Pic please? I also have a pre-unit.

  17. #37
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    farmall, a little off the subject but here's a couple pics of the pre unit, a '57 T110. This is how it looked when I bought it from the previous owner's widow. and a detail of the fender work. Supposedly ran when parked. I paid more for this one ($800 w/title) than any of the other 4 I bought, 3 of which I still have. All Projects. This one. A '55 T110 basket case. A '56 TR6 that's really complete and cries out for restoration, and a bitsa with a '52 rigid frame and trans and a '56 TR6 lower end.

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  18. #38
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    Chapter 11: Let's See Where This Is Going.

    And how do we see where we're going? Headlights, of course. Probably around 1974, I bought a '66 Ford Custom sedan. (not customized. Custom was the name of the low end full size Fords then.) What first caught my eye about it was the headlights. That car had 4 headlights, two stacked on each side. Someone had switched the high-only beams on the bottom for yellow fog lamps. I liked the pairing, one clear lens hi/low, one yellow lens. Thought I'd try that here.

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    These are Unity H4 spotlight bodies. They take a 4" light. Custom Chrome used to sell a 4" dual filament (hi/low) sealed beam. and I've got a few in my stash. But there was a problem.

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    As you can see one has a hole, probably from a knob. The other has some denting right at the point. My original thought for a fix was to make a couple of form fitting hammered copper discs with a slight protrusion at the center. I wanted to make them look like chrome plated breasts with copper areola and nipples. But that struck me as a little too dirty old man-ish. So I went this way instead.

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    I had a few taillight blue dots laying around and I also had a couple amber. I've popped the rearmost rivet out (A) and still need to tap that hole so I can attach the clip and socket (B) to the inside. I'll wire it so that the blue dot acts as my high beam indicator, and the amber dot lets me know the fog beam is on.

    But I still needed a bracket. Here's what I started with

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    I had a pair of fog light brackets from a set of fog lights that got turned into something else. In the pic one is complete and has a pencil mark and the other is what's left after some sawing. After some measuring, drilling, more cutting, grinding, welding, and metal working, this is what I came up with.

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  19. #39
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    Cool .. ^^ .. Ready to be plated ...

  20. #40
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    Chapter 11: Let's See Where This Is Going.

    Due to the 5 pic limit here on CC, this is in the next sub chapter. Anyway, This is what they look like on the bike. In this pic the bracket is in it's pre welded state.

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    I'm still not 100% sure I'm going to use them. It's hard to beat the clean and simple of a 5 3/4" Bates headlight. But now I've got both to choose from. In fact, to be truthful, I'm still not totally sure of the direction of this bike. I may end up not using the trees at the top of this page, even after all the work I went through. Somewhere I acquired a set of 5° 39 mm trees, and I have a set of complete +4 legs, fender tabs shaved from the sliders but caliper tabs remain. I have the correct caliper for those legs and a 19" 9 spoke cast wheel. The stuff deserves to be tried on the bike, see what it looks like, measure the trail. . . I had settled on a Sportster tank for this deal once, painted it and the fender, trimmed the rear tank/seat tee mounts off the frame. But now I've decided I want fatbobs again, so I had the tabs welded back on.

    So why is this taking me forever? (rhetorical question.) I admire guys who can just make a plan and stick to it.
    Last edited by MOTher; 2 Weeks Ago at 1:17 PM.

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