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  1. #1

    Join Date
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    Default How can I make my shovel faster???

    Hello.
    I have stock bore 1978 shovel 1200 (8,5).
    How can I make it faster?
    Maybe someone has a secret)

  2. #2
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    Mine's fast. It's now a 1340 with S&S superstock heads, super B carb , andrews cam and drag pipes.
    84" stoker kits were apparently a popular upgrade for 74"s as they didn't increase stroke too much.
    Then you could start with a decent coil , carb and pipes set up. How much you wanna spend/ how fast do you wanna go?

  3. #3

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    Downhill.
    Tailwind.
    Lose 50lb.

    Jim

  4. #4

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    This is me and my shovel https://www.instagram.com/p/ByhtBGGB...d=s3bhqy140yx0

    Hoghead, not so much, really.
    Well, I live in Russia, in the Krasnodar region and drive on highways. We all drive fast in cars and trucks.
    When I run 100-110 km/h(62-68 mph), sometimes I turn around and see a truck chasing me, it's unpleasant and scary)) if I could drive plus 5-10 mph, this would not happen.
    My shovel can go faster, sometimes overtaking is 140+ km/h (87 mph), but she doesn't like speed over 110 km/h(68 mph) and high rpm, I hear it and feel the vibrations.

    So, I already said, live in Russia. Buy strocker kits and other heads it’s difficult and expensive for me. And she kick only of course, big engine not for my foot)))

    Can I make a little more speed, using only my hands and a few inexpensive details?)

    JBinNC, thanks))) some time I use it)))
    Last edited by BuYakov; 07-06-2019 at 4:07 AM.

  5. #5

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    OK, I looked at your profile pic. You do not have 50lb. to lose.

    The traditional way to more HP is to increase the compression and at the same time, adding more cam. For instance, 9:1 or 9.5:1 pistons, with an Andrews A grind cam (now called an A2), or a Lieneweber L3S.
    Clean up the ports. They are plenty big (too big for a 74cu.in. motor really). Do a good 3 angle valve job. Looks like you already have a Super E carb.

    For the bike, reduce the weight. Aluminum rims are probably the best (if expensive) thing to do. That's rotating weight and unsprung weight. A skinny 21" wheel & tire on the front. Looks like your bike is pretty well stripped otherwise.

    Jim

  6. #6

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    Any 74cu.in. big twin in good condition should hit 100mph with a solo rider. With a windshield, more like 90 - 95.

    Sounds like you need to work on the smoothness, which is difficult on a shovel.
    Start with the motor. Remove the top motor mount to frame bolt. Loosen the four lower motor mount bolts. Tighten the two rear bolts to 40ft.lb. Check for any gap between the front case mount area and the frame with a feeler gauge, and shim accordingly. Tighten the front motor mount bolts to 40ft.lb. Check the top motor mount carefully for cracks. Replace if necessary. Tighten the top motor mount to head nuts to 45 - 50ft.lb. Shim the top motor mount to the frame CAREFULLY so that the mount to frame bolt does not pull the parts together. Tighten that bolt to 50 - 60ft.lb.

    Tighten the transmission plate to frame bolts to 30ft.lb. Tighten the transmission nuts and fifth bolt to 25ft lb., but be careful, as the transmission studs can be pulled out of the case with these old aluminum cases. That is one place where a little less torque is better. Adjust the primary chain to 5/8 - 7/8 slack, cold. Adjust at the tightest point on the chain. If all points on the chain don't fall between 5/8 and 7/8, the chain is worn out and should be replaced.
    Balance the tires.

    That should take care of the vibration trouble areas on your big twin. (Of course the motors naturally vibrate, but the 74s are the smoothest of the lot.)

    You gotta keep working and tuning on the whole bike. They will run, even with a stock motor, as long as it's not too tired.

    Jim

  7. #7

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    In your profile pic you have a Super E, but the other pic shows a two-throat. The two- throat is a little tricky to tune, how do you like it?

    Jim

  8. #8

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    Really nice sled, by the way!
    I imagine that is quite an effort for you in Russia, because tracking down parts must be a chore.

    Jim

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    I'm a huge believer in stroke. And big bore. Done right you have a reliable, quick, and powerful motor.

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    All it takes is money the more you spend the faster the bike.

  11. #11
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    OK-forget the heads and stroker kit, but run a performance cam, decent ignition coil, exhaust and carb. Set it up well, and raise the gearing (sprocket change) to run with the trucks on your roads.

    Trust me , no-one tailgates this one...

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Hoghead; 07-06-2019 at 7:09 AM.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockman96 View Post
    I'm a huge believer in stroke. And big bore. Done right you have a reliable, quick, and powerful motor.
    .... This ^^ ....


  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by JBinNC View Post
    OK, I looked at your profile pic. You do not have 50lb. to lose.
    The traditional way to more HP is to increase the compression and at the same time, adding more cam. For instance, 9:1 or 9.5:1 pistons, with an Andrews A grind cam (now called an A2), or a Lieneweber L3S.
    Clean up the ports. They are plenty big (too big for a 74cu.in. motor really). Do a good 3 angle valve job.
    For the bike, reduce the weight. Aluminum rims are probably the best (if expensive) thing to do. That's rotating weight and unsprung weight. A skinny 21" wheel & tire on the front. Looks like your bike is pretty well stripped otherwise.
    Jim
    Jim, thank you very much for your advice!

    Okay, I understand. Pistons, cam, port and valve works.
    What about pushrods, tappets and valve springs?
    Do I need to replace them? If yes, then on what?

    About weight. I can to replace some brass (itís heavy weight) on aluminum.
    Other should stay like on the last photo. Because I dream about an article in Dice and love this style

    Quote Originally Posted by JBinNC View Post
    Any 74cu.in. big twin in good condition should hit 100mph with a solo rider. With a windshield, more like 90 - 95.
    Sounds like you need to work on the smoothness, which is difficult on a shovel.
    Start with the motor.
    Tighten the transmission plate to frame bolts to 30ft.lb. Tighten the transmission nuts and fifth bolt to 25ft lb.
    Adjust the primary chain.
    Balance the tires.
    Jim
    Okay, I'll do it.
    Donít have chain in primary, itís bld 1,5Ē now.

    Quote Originally Posted by JBinNC View Post
    In your profile pic you have a Super E, but the other pic shows a two-throat. The two- throat is a little tricky to tune, how do you like it?
    Jim
    Yep, now install two throat. Itís difficult to tune, I feel it)))
    Have original manifold, without hole and some jets.
    On next week I start made new 2-2 exhaust with spiral baffles. I think itís help me tune tt.


    Quote Originally Posted by JBinNC View Post
    Really nice sled, by the way!
    I imagine that is quite an effort for you in Russia, because tracking down parts must be a chore.
    Jim
    Thank you.
    Itís difficult and expensive in Russia. We don't have any details for old harleys.
    And sometimes the wait is very long.
    I start in 2015 with frame, engine and transmission. All other items searched and bought around the world.



    Quote Originally Posted by Hoghead View Post
    OK-forget the heads and stroker kit, but run a performance cam, decent ignition coil, exhaust and carb. Set it up well, and raise the gearing (sprocket change) to run with the trucks on your roads.

    Trust me , no-one tailgates this one...
    Nice bike man! Thanks for your advice!

    On my shovel install crane cams hi4 single fire ignition and same coil.

    On transmission 25t sprocket. Itís max size for install on foot shift transmission 1978 year.
    Japan guys run with 27-28 tr spr...
    So, I have suicide hand shifter. Can I install old hand shift top on my 78 transmission?

  14. #14
    SamHain
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    Little head work will make it stomp on a stock one. I’ve only rode 80”, but was pretty satisfied with it after that. Little porting, big intake valves and some decent springs, they get down they highway pretty good.

  15. #15

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    Oct 2018
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuYakov View Post
    Hello.
    I have stock bore 1978 shovel 1200 (8,5).
    How can I make it faster?
    Maybe someone has a secret)
    Get a 1200cc blockhead Sporty, it's quicker, faster, lighter and more reliable. (just yanking your chain)

    There is no easy way to build a more efficient motor and to get reliable power with a broad streetable powerband takes planning. Other than good porting or just going 'bigger', changing only one aspect of the ICE cycle may show gains in some areas but at the expense of another, like robbing Peter to pay Paul so that's where the planning comes in. In the end it's as Grease Rat says "speed is just a question of money..."

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by BuYakov View Post
    ...On next week I start made new 2-2 exhaust with spiral baffles. I think itís help me tune tt...
    People tend to underestimate the importance of a tuned exhaust system on a street bike and allow style to dictate the type of exhaust they run. Probably the most ignored aspect of the exhaust is also the one that's most evident, the sound waves. The effect that harmonic reversion has on a motor and misunderstanding it as 'back-pressure' (which gave rise to the 'lollipop fix') seems to never be addressed but here's a video that I think does a good job explaining the principle. Hopefully it proves to be informative and helps you design your next exhaust system.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezpM5rGpIx8

    BTW, do you know how many rpms your motor is turning when doing 110 km/h? I'm not sure what your gearing translates to but I am curious.

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by SamHain View Post
    Little head work will make it stomp on a stock one. Iíve only rode 80Ē, but was pretty satisfied with it after that. Little porting, big intake valves and some decent springs, they get down they highway pretty good.
    Thanks!
    I'm thinking about general work, including working with heads.

    Quote Originally Posted by Skjoll View Post
    Get a 1200cc blockhead Sporty, it's quicker, faster, lighter and more reliable. (just yanking your chain)

    There is no easy way to build a more efficient motor and to get reliable power with a broad streetable powerband takes planning. Other than good porting or just going 'bigger', changing only one aspect of the ICE cycle may show gains in some areas but at the expense of another, like robbing Peter to pay Paul so that's where the planning comes in. In the end it's as Grease Rat says "speed is just a question of money..."
    Thank you!

    I had a sporty some time ago. I sold it quickly, because I didn't like it.

    Understand.. But I hope to keep the elasticity of the engine. Like stock, but little more.

    Quote Originally Posted by Skjoll View Post
    People tend to underestimate the importance of a tuned exhaust system on a street bike and allow style to dictate the type of exhaust they run. Probably the most ignored aspect of the exhaust is also the one that's most evident, the sound waves. The effect that harmonic reversion has on a motor and misunderstanding it as 'back-pressure' (which gave rise to the 'lollipop fix') seems to never be addressed but here's a video that I think does a good job explaining the principle. Hopefully it proves to be informative and helps you design your next exhaust system.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezpM5rGpIx8

    BTW, do you know how many rpms your motor is turning when doing 110 km/h? I'm not sure what your gearing translates to but I am curious.
    Yep, itís my favorite video on ss YouTube channel. I understand the need for good exhaust (and air filter too), so I want to make a new one with baffles.

    I do not know rpm, donít have any gauges)

  18. #18
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    I like tall final drive gearing to drop RPMs at cruising speed. (I don't bother with a tach and don't care if my speedo works or not.) A four tooth smaller rear sprocket is a good start.

    Pretty seats aren't comfortable. I used to run a thick stock HD buddy seat (which I should have kept when I sold the bike) for long trips and throw on something thinner for local work. My current Shovels have Bar Enterprises solo seats which are wide enough to avoid anal abuse but I don't take my Shovels on long trips since I've FXRs for that. Shovel rear suspension geometry sucks so a good seat is how HD compensated. They were successful touring bikes because of this.

    I beat lead fishing sinkers into the ends of my handlebars to dampen vibration. It's a very old trick.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by farmall View Post
    I like tall final drive gearing to drop RPMs at cruising speed. (I don't bother with a tach and don't care if my speedo works or not.) A four tooth smaller rear sprocket is a good start.

    Pretty seats aren't comfortable. I used to run a thick stock HD buddy seat (which I should have kept when I sold the bike) for long trips and throw on something thinner for local work. My current Shovels have Bar Enterprises solo seats which are wide enough to avoid anal abuse but I don't take my Shovels on long trips since I've FXRs for that. Shovel rear suspension geometry sucks so a good seat is how HD compensated. They were successful touring bikes because of this.

    I beat lead fishing sinkers into the ends of my handlebars to dampen vibration. It's a very old trick.
    Hello, farmall. Thanks.

    I have drum break on rear wheel, itís 51t and canít be smaller. 25/51

    I donít have problems with long ride on my shovel. LePera signature seat, itís best choice for my ass.
    And new progressive suspension shocks doing their job well. I care only about cruise speed.

    Thanks for attitude about lead sinkers, I totally forgot about that!

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