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  1. #141

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tattooo View Post
    I went and took a pic of my stud removal tool to show what it looks like....... It sure makes it easy....... I've had this one at least 35 years,.,.,
    AHHH that makes sense! Just found youtube videos of those. Holy smokes. I need to find one.

  2. #142

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    PS - this is the rendering I have for the engine. But... a few disclaimers:

    - This is just for reference... a work in progress.
    - This comes from two CAD images from Mark's site at DBBP. Dude is wild.
    - I photoshopped together the cylinders/heads from one image onto the other side image.
    - minor difference, the nose cone will be replaced with a magneto nose cone so that will take up a solid portion of the blank space below where the carb used to be.
    - cases hand polished to a medium level. Nothing too mirror like. Just cleaned up nice like the Dellorto I did.
    - Jugs and heads powdered via Dragstews.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  3. #143
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    Check out these unknown converted Panheads:

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    http://victorylibrary.com/tech/panhead-c.htm

  4. #144
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    ^^^^^^ Now that will be much easier.......^^^^^^^^^^^

  5. #145

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tattooo View Post
    Have you ever ridden a bike with a foot clutch very much??
    You'll love this... fact is I have never ridden with a foot clutch. This will be my first.

    (( bring on the abuse for designing myself into a corner with a function like foot clutch that I've never actually experienced... I'm ready... ))

  6. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by bpeak View Post
    You'll love this... fact is I have never ridden with a foot clutch. This will be my first.

    (( bring on the abuse for designing myself into a corner with a function like foot clutch that I've never actually experienced... I'm ready... ))
    No need, I think you have an idea of what your up against......

    I had a feeling you had never ridden a foot clutch bike since you were ignoring the things that you can't ignore......

    You will learn once you get it together....... That's a hard way to learn but at least you will learn......

    Best of luck.....

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by bpeak View Post
    You'll love this... fact is I have never ridden with a foot clutch. This will be my first.

    (( bring on the abuse for designing myself into a corner with a function like foot clutch that I've never actually experienced... I'm ready... ))
    How about some (cut/paste) advice...from 33ers:

    2015 Thread: Foot clutch and hand shift advice ?

    "...PUT THE BIKE IN NEUTRAL BEFORE YOU PUT YOUR FEET DOWN."
    "If you can't ride with a foot clutch.... Don't....."
    "But WTF do I know??"
    "Motorcycles are dangerous. So have fun, but be careful."
    http://www.chopcult.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41324

  8. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by
    "...PUT THE BIKE IN NEUTRAL BEFORE YOU PUT YOUR FEET DOWN

    That sounds like something a person that had never ridden a bike with foot clutch would say....

    So many times that's not possible......... Have time to put it in neutral that is.....

    But WTF do I know????????? Yea I said that.......

  9. #149

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    So back to the heads... had some success this weekend.

    For those last studs... I was able to break one free finally with the new extractor tool. So now I was just down to one of the main rocker box studs... and the center little shorty that is in the middle of the box. Those are the last two that NOTHING was going to remove em.

    So I cut off the tops with the angle grinder and ground them as close to the head as possible without actually taking any metal out of the head. Then drilled em in prep for ez-out.

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    The center stud came out with the ez-out. Kinda surprising.But as you can see in the pic below - that last main stud... not so much. Ez-out or no... it wasn't coming.

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    So I took to the ol dremel and started grinding out the stud from the inside. Every so often when it got to an inner diameter of the next size up ez-out I'd give it a shot. Nothing. Would not budge. Ended up grinding manually every last sliver of the old stud to the point where I was pulling out individual threads from within the hole. Even that I had to pry out. It was so bad. All I can figure is that someone previously got this thing cross threaded, with loctite, and way too much torque, and then it reacted and seized in, or something. Never seen it so bad.

    BUT - I WIN.

    With the critical studs out of the way, I could finally mock up a rocker box on the head BACKWARDS. Check it out:

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    ok so a few lessons learned and new challenges:

    1. I'm going to have to swap two of the outer studs. Never took into account that one of the outer rocker box studs is short which fits a lower recess in the rocker box. So I need to swap the short outer for a long outer. Great. I already removed that short outer with just a basic double-nut method. Threads are saved. Now I gotta remove a tall stud. Here's hopin. But I have a few of the other tall studs that came out double nut and still have good threads so I may just use the extractor on this last one (which ruins the threads).

    2. I triple checked all the measurements and feel very confident in the rocker arms still making contact with the valves correctly.

    3. I checked the insertion of a spark plug. Technically it fits. It will not be the most joyful thing to remove or get access to when the bike is assembled, but it will work and still be able to be removed. So that part is all good.

    4. I now have the distances measured for the top motor mount. The large top motor mount stud (which I also removed) is now currently UNDER the rockerbox overhang right where the carb USED to be. Being this tight fit, I have a design for a countersunk bolt into a plate steel motor mount rather than using the stud/plate/nut method. This keeps it super low profile and makes everything fit. So I just have to remember this when assembling the top end. Cylinders... Heads... Intake manifold alignment... Torque the cylinders/heads... Top motor mount plate... THEN the rocker boxes. Prolly be a 3 or 4 piece top motor mount for ease of installing the mill into the frame. Since there won't be adjustment at the head bolt, I wont be able to have one solid piece that connects the two heads. That wouldn't leave room for the heads to rotate to fit the manifold. So it will be a bit of an assembly for the overall mount. But I think I can make it work, and still look cool, without being too mousetrap-ish.

    All in all, I'm pumped and excited. I've thought through this process so much over the past months figuring it all out in my head. To see it now taking shape is a blast. Bummer is... now I have to do it all over again on the OTHER head. Shoot. But hey, at least I know what not to do now and at least I have some better tools! Haha.

    Thanks again for all your help guys. Cheers.
    Last edited by bpeak; 4 Weeks Ago at 9:37 AM.

  10. #150
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    The fluted square extractors are better than those spiral things.
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    Great to see you won and got 'em out - hope the rest are easier.

    Interesting process for your idea.

  11. #151

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    Quote Originally Posted by TriNortchopz View Post
    The fluted square extractors are better than those spiral things.
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    Great to see you won and got 'em out - hope the rest are easier.

    Interesting process for your idea.
    Ahh cool I might need to grab a set of those. I know my drill hole was off center too which prolly didn't help. Learn somethin new every day. Thanks man.

  12. #152

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    Made some good progress over the past few days. Second head, now that I had a good plan of attack... worked fine. All studs came out clean.

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    This allowed me to mock up the rocker boxes on both heads now. Good to go.

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    Then I got busy on the bottom end. Took apart the nose cone and cam chest. More on that in another post. But for now... figured I'd try to mock up the engine in the frame.

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    Turns out the front head, now on the rear, has some fins that I'll need to grind to miss the seat post. Easy peasy since it's just fins. Won't have to cut into the body of the head or mess with the seat post. should be pretty straight forward.

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    More pics coming...

  13. #153

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    Similar story on the front. This frame tab was in the way. I was going to remove that tab anyway... was just a bummer for it to be there and prohibit proper mockup of the top end.

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    But even with this junk in the way, I was able to set the heads roughly on the bike. They are off angle and kinda wonky, but it gave me my first real look at what it might end up looking like. check it out:

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    And I (of course) couldn't help myself. Had to do an awkward one-handed shot in selfie mode to get the right angle. HAD to see the carb.

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    Starting to make sense? Super close to getting it bolted up as a mockup to start testing the riding position, foot controls location, and alignment of the drivetrain to mate up to the ironhead rear drum so that I can build my custom rear axle plates/boxes and get the frame fab complete.

    So... much... more... to... go. One day at a time right?

  14. #154
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    Now that's a 'head-turner'!
    Looks like one thirsty carb. The seat post looks close to the exhaust port pipe mounts - won't be a clearance problem for the rear pipe?

  15. #155

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    Quote Originally Posted by TriNortchopz View Post
    Now that's a 'head-turner'!
    Looks like one thirsty carb. The seat post looks close to the exhaust port pipe mounts - won't be a clearance problem for the rear pipe?
    Thanks man! Yea it will be close. It's hard to say for sure right now because the rear by the seat post is still propped up because of the fin-hit. Once it sits down on the cylinder that will bring the exhaust port more facing down. I'll have to see once it gets bolted up. I think it will clear, it might just be an issue of having that heat too close to the painted frame. Not sure. If I have to, I'll modify the seat post. Just hope that's not the case. Either way we'll be good.

    Honestly, the bigger concern for me at the moment is the exhaust port on the rear vs. the clutch cable stay bracket below it. I was planning on running a cable foot clutch based on some talks with Caleb at Cro Customs and a setup he recently made. But this might put the cable in conflict with the exhaust. Not sure how all that is going to go. We'll see.

  16. #156
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    An option might be a hydraulic clutch. A lot more flexible (I think)

  17. #157

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    In other news, here's where I'm headed with the axle blocks. Did this up in CAD today over lunch based on a 2D drawing I've been working on for a while. My goal is to get it simple and enclosed. I want to see as little as possible but still have adjustment. Key is that I'm using as much of the stock ironhead axle hardware as possible and trying to keep the fab as simple as possible. The only thing seen will be out the front for the adjuster stem and some sort of thread cover (prolly wont do that acorn up there but some sort of rubber thread cover or something).

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    The orange outer plate will be aluminum... engraved. Going to be a trick to cut and weld in the little inner tabs and the flat spot for the adjuster nut. But other than that, should be pretty straightforward. Math gives me 5/8" of adjustment which isn't much but should be ok-ish (even if I have to add a half link, it's all good to me).

    More to come. Hope you all have an awesome weekend!

  18. #158
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    Likin' your axle blocks. Got a few comments;

    you have a rectangular hole in the back with flats at front and back, but the light green stepped slider/spacer(?) has flats at the top and bottom only - if flats are at front and back, you would increase axle adjustment within the rectangular hole.

    Is the step in the light green guy just a few thou narrower than the thickness of the back plate, so the thick red washer does not end up concaved when the nut is tightened?

    You have a castle nut, so will there be a hole through the axle for a cotter pin? Got enough room inside the round body to easily install/remove the pin?

    For the cap, to keep it clean on the face (no screws) you could make it thicker with a step that slide fits into the bore, and have a setscrew through the bottom to hold it in, and the step could have an o-ring groove so the o-ring would seal on the inside of the body and would keep shit outta there. The cover step that slide fits into the body could be like a washer, so there is still clearance in the center for the castle nut and cotterpin. That would eliminate the screws on the face, the two tabs inside, and keep it all clean.

    For the adjuster bolt for the chain, just cut a square hole through the front of the round body, thread a square block for the adjuster nut, and weld it in place from the outside. It could be stepped too, so the square on the inside is larger than the square part that fits through the square hole in the body, so the weld would be against the inner step as the body will be chamfered, so stronger and easier to hide.

    Instead of going with a half-link when chain and sprockets wear and you run out of adjustment, what about a hidden chain adjuster, (like a tensioner but not need to be spring loaded), on the bottom run of the chain to take up that 1/2 link slack?
    You say math gives 5/8" adjustment; a 530 chain has a 5/8 pitch (first number is pitch in 1/8s of an inch, second number is width inside the sideplates, in 1/8s of an inch), so with just a bit more adjustment, you can do it without a half-link...probably gonna replace chain and sprockets before they are that worn anyhow.
    Have a great weekend!
    Last edited by TriNortchopz; 3 Weeks Ago at 12:04 AM. Reason: added step in square

  19. #159

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    Quote Originally Posted by TriNortchopz View Post
    Likin' your axle blocks. Got a few comments;

    you have a rectangular hole in the back with flats at front and back, but the light green stepped slider/spacer(?) has flats at the top and bottom only - if flats are at front and back, you would increase axle adjustment within the rectangular hole.

    Is the step in the light green guy just a few thou narrower than the thickness of the back plate, so the thick red washer does not end up concaved when the nut is tightened?

    You have a castle nut, so will there be a hole through the axle for a cotter pin? Got enough room inside the round body to easily install/remove the pin?

    For the cap, to keep it clean on the face (no screws) you could make it thicker with a step that slide fits into the bore, and have a setscrew through the bottom to hold it in, and the step could have an o-ring groove so the o-ring would seal on the inside of the body and would keep shit outta there. The cover step that slide fits into the body could be like a washer, so there is still clearance in the center for the castle nut and cotterpin. That would eliminate the screws on the face, the two tabs inside, and keep it all clean.

    For the adjuster bolt for the chain, just cut a square hole through the front of the round body, thread a square block for the adjuster nut, and weld it in place from the outside. It could be stepped too, so the square on the inside is larger than the square part that fits through the square hole in the body, so the weld would be against the inner step as the body will be chamfered, so stronger and easier to hide.

    Instead of going with a half-link when chain and sprockets wear and you run out of adjustment, what about a hidden chain adjuster, (like a tensioner but not need to be spring loaded), on the bottom run of the chain to take up that 1/2 link slack?
    You say math gives 5/8" adjustment; a 530 chain has a 5/8 pitch (first number is pitch in 1/8s of an inch, second number is width inside the sideplates, in 1/8s of an inch), so with just a bit more adjustment, you can do it without a half-link...probably gonna replace chain and sprockets before they are that worn anyhow.
    Have a great weekend!
    Dude you rule. This gave me so many ideas when I woke up at 4am this morning. Haha.

    On point 1 with the flats - I might try that but the light green spacer with the flats is the stock ironhead spacer that keeps the axle centered in the slot. Those will come chromed and exposed. I'll have to see.

    On point 2 - yes, the light green stepped spacer fits the slot and the red washer is just to keep the gap between the blue axle adjuster and the axle back plate. The pressure on the red washer will be uniform so - good to go.

    On point 3 with the castle nut - I'm still undecided how I want to lock the nut in. There would be space for a thin cotter pin, yes. But I might end up just using the shallower solid nut... and having the axle drilled... and use speed wire like on all the race bikes... to keep the nut locked in place. the other option I had was for the red washer to actually be a lock tab washer with an arm that goes into the axle block slot to keep the washer from rotating... then tabs that can be bent over the hex of teh nut and lock everything in. To Be Determined I guess.

    On point 4 - for the cap - that would be rad to do a set screw. Awesome idea. I'll have to draw that up.

    On point 5 - for the adjuster bolt hole - dude you gave me an awesome (easier) idea. I might not do a square hole... but round. So rather than fabbing and weling in a sliver to get that flat spot... I'll find a piece of steel tub that as the OD I need... and the ID to fit the threaded part of the adjuster. Then drill the outer axle block based on the OD of that tube. Weld in the tube - bam - theres the simple seat for the adjuster nut to rest against. Easy peasy and I can fab that myself. THANK YOU.

    On point 6 - I've been pondering a chain tensioner for sure. I might need to run one. We'll see how all this goes.

    Lastly, perhaps this would help. I know it isn't updated for the stuff mentioned above, but this should help to be able to see the layers when they are all sandwiched together.

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    THanks again tho man. MUCH APPRECIATED! CHEERS!

  20. #160

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    In other news - I was able to grind off the front frame tab... and the fins at the rear seat post. I officially have then engine and carb mocked up!!!!!!

    FINALLY!!!

    Check it out...

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