CHOP CULT HOME
Email Password
Search
Page 1 of 2 12 Last

Thread: Frame opinions

  1. #1
    Silvaglass
    Guest

    Default Frame opinions

    So I got this 57 santee frame which was modified to fit a 230 rear tire. Got her running and driving, tracks good, runs like a beast, trans is leaky but I'll get to that a bit later. Who ever did it did an decent job. My problem is under the seat there is 2 tubes in the rear. I want to remove that inner tube to clean it up so it looks better with the springer seat I want to put on and to put a full weld on the bungs for the springs and will be easier to run wires through the frame for the taillight. I've never seen one like this.

    So my question is this....should I even remove it for strength reasons, if I do would I need some gussets or would it be okay without? If I leave it I may do a sheet metal cover to go under the seat so it is cleaner looking. And I'm gonna flip the fender mount to hide underneath as well.

    Thanks for the insight!!!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 20160626_173716.jpg  

  2. #2

    Default

    if you remove that I would at least run triange gussets on the inside corners of the existing tube, and possibly underneath. THe reason they left that in there was to give them something to weld to when they put the new 230 "hoop" on, and removing it isnt going to leave you allot of meat, and a 230 tire/rim is allot of mass to be bouncing out of potholes.

    Honestly, unless you are going to redo the entire section of the frame I would leave that alone.

  3. #3
    Silvaglass
    Guest

    Default

    Thanks for the advice. It definitely makes sense. Wish whoever it was left it a 180. I got the the bike for a steal so I figured what the hell. I'll get creative and clean it up. Maybe even notch out the top of both tubes and put in some flat bar to make it look like 1 piece which would add more strength as well.
    Thanks for the input!

  4. #4
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    9,296

    Default

    I like the flat bar idea because besides being very strong and looking good, you can hang seat mounts or whatever else you like off it. If ya gonna ride it, make it indestructible.I probably wouldn't notch the tubes but would nestle the flat bar between them. You can mock up different options with cardboard and even tape it in place to get a visual before you cut metal.

    Small gussets elsewhere can add a lot of strength, and you can mold them by pad welding for even more strength instead of fucking with Bondo for a chobberly finished look.
    Last edited by farmall; 06-27-2016 at 9:52 AM.

  5. #5
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,688

    Default

    I think I would grind out and replace any welds that look like the ones where they tied the rear on. Those especially the one to my left would worry me enough to take the fun out of riding.
    Dusty

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DustyDave View Post
    I think I would grind out and replace any welds that look like the ones where they tied the rear on. Those especially the one to my left would worry me enough to take the fun out of riding.
    Dusty
    I was thinking that as well, some serious side cut going on.
    the one on the left has some spatter, and a bit of cold lap, but the one on the right looks like they dug it out and didn't fill it back in. thats a big no-no acorss the heat effected zone.

  7. #7

    Default

    just found out I could zoom, both sides are undercut. only weld that looks right is on the part OP would want to remove

  8. #8
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    9,296

    Default

    I didn't zoom and should have. Concur on replacing the welds. Not a lot of work to eliminate potential problems.

  9. #9
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    158

    Default

    What do the rest of the welds on the frame look like?

  10. #10
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    430

    Default

    I agree those welds would make me suspect. I would take the time to blast the frame and inspect at a minimum.

  11. #11
    Silvaglass
    Guest

    Default

    Thanks for all the input. I definitely planned on cleaning up all of the old welds. A few on the bottom need a ltitle love. I've put a couple hundred miles on it and it's pretty stout, no cracks or anything. I feel comfortable it will hold. There's enough good meat in most of it. Rest of the frame is straight. I'm a welder by trade, just never done any frame work on a bike. A buddy of mine has a frame jig and a tig rig which i don't have. But i may just take my time and do it wirh my mig. Then come winter I'm doing a complete teardown for cleanup and new paint.
    And filling that Valley I like better than notching out the tubes...thanks for that.
    Seriously really appreciate all the input fellas. I'll post updates as I get it done.
    Last edited by Silvaglass; 06-27-2016 at 9:36 PM.

  12. #12
    Silvaglass
    Guest

    Default

    And definitely no bondo. I'm definitely familiar with pad welding and grinding. Ha
    Again thanks a bunch guys. See ya on the pavement soon!!!

  13. #13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Silvaglass View Post
    Thanks for all the input. I definitely planned on cleaning up all of the old welds. A few on the bottom need a ltitle love. I've put a couple hundred miles on it and it's pretty stout, no cracks or anything. I feel comfortable it will hold. Rest of the frame is straight. I'm a welder by trade, just never done any frame work on a bike. A buddy of mine has a frame jig and a tig rig which I don't have. So all those welds will be cleaned up soon as he gets some free time. Then come winter I'm doing a complete teardown for cleanup and new paint.
    And filling that Valley I like better than notching out the tubes...thanks for that.
    Seriously really appreciate all the input fellas.
    with those top welds you could run a pass of 3/32 7018 and have a weld way stronger than TIG without having to grind out what's already there. Frame welding is just like any other welding, if you have enough meat it's still way better to go with 7018 LHR than anything else.

  14. #14
    Silvaglass
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Keeleyvision View Post
    with those top welds you could run a pass of 3/32 7018 and have a weld way stronger than TIG without having to grind out what's already there. Frame welding is just like any other welding, if you have enough meat it's still way better to go with 7018 LHR than anything else.
    Yea I was wanting to avoid splatter but I have enough old leather and Kevlar to cover stuff. And I have a stick welder. Just need new rods. Chances are I'll tackle them one by one and take my time. Just don't want to tweak the frame at all. I guess I'm being over paranoid about it.

  15. #15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Silvaglass View Post
    Yea I was wanting to avoid splatter but I have enough old leather and Kevlar to cover stuff. And I have a stick welder. Just need new rods. Chances are I'll tackle them one by one and take my time. Just don't want to tweak the frame at all. I guess I'm being over paranoid about it.
    No such thing as over paranoid with a frame or front end

  16. #16
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    9,296

    Default

    It's nice to see someone advocating 7018. I'm only a mechanic who welds (a true weldor is a fucking artist) but love 7018. Lincoln and ESAB run out nice. We were gifted a pallet of Hobart at the welding school where I worked but it tended to stick. That Washington Alloy/Radnor stuff Airgas sells is hit or miss depending where they source it so I avoid it.

    I got spoiled by rod ovens and use a toaster oven to warm small quantities at home. Warm rod runs so much nicer.

    BTW 7018 doesn't spatter much. If worried wrap some foil nearby or scissor some protective sheet from empty beer cans.

    For the new folks, always set or check your amps by welding a piece of clean scrap before welding your workpiece. Make it a habit like the pros do. An amp pointer isn't as precise as seeing and feeling as you weld, and if you test every time you can walk up to any machine and set it comfortably.
    Last edited by farmall; 06-30-2016 at 11:48 AM.

  17. #17

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by farmall View Post
    It's nice to see someone advocating 7018. I'm only a mechanic who welds (a true weldor is a fucking artist) but love 7018. Lincoln and ESAB run out nice. We were gifted a pallet of Hobart at the welding school where I worked but it tended to stick. That Washington Alloy/Radnor stuff Airgas sells is hit or miss depending where they source it so I avoid it.

    I got spoiled by rod ovens and use a toaster oven to warm small quantities at home. Warm rod runs so much nicer.

    BTW 7018 doesn't spatter much. If worried wrap some foil nearby or scissor some protective sheet from empty beer cans.

    For the new folks, always set or check your amps by welding a piece of clean scrap before welding your workpiece. Make it a habit like the pros do. An amp pointer isn't as precise as seeing and feeling as you weld, and if you test every time you can walk up to any machine and set it comfortably.
    It's not just inaccuracies in the dial, every machine runs differently. Once upon a time it would not be unheard of for me to run 2 or 3 different SA200's in a day, all on the same job, doing the same thing, with the same rod. One would dig in hard, one would dig less but run smoother, one would dig less but run "choppy"... all three had to pass X-ray or ultrasound, or lives were depending on the guy at the end of the whip not fucking it up, and that means running some test coupons

  18. #18
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    9,296

    Default

    I never got to weld with an SA but the design is elegant in its simplicity. It's cool that many 1940s and '50s SAs are still out there making money. No fancy PC boards to fry and die.

    I don't need an engine driven welder but if one comes my way cheap I'd give it a home and freshen it up. Those flathead fours will outlive any twin in a Bobcat or Ranger several times over.

    Since this is a chopper forum:

    http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?312111-SA-200-chop

  19. #19

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by farmall View Post
    I never got to weld with an SA but the design is elegant in its simplicity. It's cool that many 1940s and '50s SAs are still out there making money. No fancy PC boards to fry and die.

    I don't need an engine driven welder but if one comes my way cheap I'd give it a home and freshen it up. Those flathead fours will outlive any twin in a Bobcat or Ranger several times over.

    Since this is a chopper forum:

    http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?312111-SA-200-chop
    A friend of mine that I came up with in the patch years ago, and I were just talking about wanting to do this with an old machine.

  20. #20
    Senior Member

    Content on this page requires a newer version of Adobe Flash Player.

    Get Adobe Flash player


    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    9,296

    Default

    Parts availability is great (I used to hunt them for my less internet savvy pipelinerbro).

    Manual downloads: http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us...=name&q=SA-200

    WW sticky: http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php...nfo-FAQ-Sticky

    Fowler goodies and other parts: http://hybriweld.com/products.html?limit=all&mode=list
    Last edited by farmall; 07-05-2016 at 8:26 PM.

Share This



Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Log in

Log in