Here in AZ we have those cameras to catch you speeding. My chick got snapped by one, doing 57 in a 45. She ignored the 1st ticket that was mailed, and told her dad n brother not to answer the door for strangers, hoping she could duck the process server until the 90 day limit was up. Well, her little bro answered the door and got served the papers. Thing is, he's 15. Anyone in AZ know for sure if this is legal?
I spent some time reading up on it, and the rules of civil procedure don't define an age. It says:
Quote:
Service upon an individual from whom a waiver has not been obtained and filed, other than those specified in paragraphs (e), (f) and (g) of this Rule 4.1, shall be effected by delivering a copy of the summons and of the pleading to that individual personally or by leaving copies thereof at that individual's dwelling house or usual place of abode with some person of suitable age and discretion then residing therein or by delivering a copy of the summons and of the pleading to an agent authorized by appointment or by law to receive service of process.
The next section, titled "Service of Summons Upon Minors" specifically names age 16.
Quote:
Service of Summons Upon Minors. Service upon a minor under the age of sixteen years shall be effected by service in the manner set forth in paragraph (d) of this Rule 4.1 upon the minor and upon the minor's father, mother or guardian, within this state, or if none is found therein, then upon any person having the care and control of such minor, or with whom the minor resides.
So, based on this, she's thinking about telling the court that this service is invalid. Now how the hell do we do that? Not gonna lie, part of this is me wanting to "stick it to the man", but another part of it is that she just can't afford to pay the ticket right now.
Sorry man- I heard the speed traps on the highway were challanged and shown to be illegal. So everyone was "sorta" told to ignore them if you get a ticket in the mail.
The street traps for speeders are a BITCH! They have them all over the place. I think your best option is to go to the court and ask for an extension or payment options (if they have it...)
As for sticking it to the man... They have it worded like a Hoodini Clause...
Service of Summons Upon Minors. Service upon a minor under the age of sixteen years shall be effected by service in the manner set forth in paragraph (d) of this Rule 4.1
Rule 4.1, shall be effected by delivering a copy of the summons and of the pleading to that individual personally or by leaving copies thereof at that individual's dwelling house or usual place of abode with some person of suitable age and discretion
Tech most states allow you to leave your child alone at 12... Or if they are more mature and can show they know how and who to get ahold of in-case of emergency. 15 is considered to be a mature/suitable person "per-say".
Sorry man- I heard the speed traps on the highway were challanged and shown to be illegal. So everyone was "sorta" told to ignore them if you get a ticket in the mail.
The street traps for speeders are a BITCH! They have them all over the place. I think your best option is to go to the court and ask for an extension or payment options (if they have it...)
As for sticking it to the man... They have it worded like a Hoodini Clause...
Service of Summons Upon Minors. Service upon a minor under the age of sixteen years shall be effected by service in the manner set forth in paragraph (d) of this Rule 4.1
Rule 4.1, shall be effected by delivering a copy of the summons and of the pleading to that individual personally or by leaving copies thereof at that individual's dwelling house or usual place of abode with some person of suitable age and discretion
Tech most states allow you to leave your child alone at 12... Or if they are more mature and can show they know how and who to get ahold of in-case of emergency. 15 is considered to be a mature/suitable person "per-say".
Best of luck- AZ Courts SUCK!
Yeah, like you said... It's worded all fucked up. "Suitable age" could mean anything. Like I quoted above, in the next section it says that any minor being served must be 16 so serving a 15 yr old on behalf of an adult shouldn't be allowed. I need to see what we need to do to tell the courts that this service is invalid.
And yeah, they did get rid of the cameras on the highways. They still have the vans and cameras on surface streets. They changed the way they do the tickets, too. I just reach back and cover my license plate w/ my hand and full throttle right on by haha
[QUOTE=Pendulum;300078]Yeah, like you said... It's worded all fucked up. "Suitable age" could mean anything. Like I quoted above, in the next section it says that any minor being served must be 16 so serving a 15 yr old on behalf of an adult shouldn't be allowed. I need to see what we need to do to tell the courts that this service is invalid.
Pendulum- I do wish you the best man. but, if what you posted orginally (the mans VC) is true... It looks like it was a legal service (but, im no lawyer- this is just experiance). I bolded the basic info below and the error above. Like you said- its worded as a loop hole... Sorry man. Go to the court and ask for a break. They are way too eager to lock people up for stupid shit. No sence in waisting your time or your girls with towing and a bench warrent.
The next section, titled "Service of Summons Upon Minors" specifically names age 16.
Quote:
Service of Summons Upon Minors. Service upon a minor under the age of sixteen years shall be effected by service in the manner set forth in paragraph (d) of this Rule 4.1 upon the minor and upon the minor's father, mother or guardian, within this state, or if none is found therein, then upon any person having the care and control of such minor, or with whom the minor resides.
Service upon an individual from whom a waiver has not been obtained and filed, other than those specified in paragraphs (e), (f) and (g) of this Rule 4.1, shall be effected by delivering a copy of the summons and of the pleading to that individual personally or by leaving copies thereof at that individual's dwelling house or usual place of abode with some person of suitable age and discretion then residing therein or by delivering a copy of the summons and of the pleading to an agent authorized by appointment or by law to receive service of process.
Again man- best of luck. They want your money and need it... My recommendation is dont give them additional reasons to f-with you or tap your bank account.
Basically- It dosent say the person MUST be 16... It says a person UNDER the age of 16.
As much as we all hate to get caught doing something wrong, especially being caught by a camera the fact here is she was speeding, she broke the law and now she has to pay. Get over it and pay the ticket and move on.
As much as we all hate to get caught doing something wrong, especially being caught by a camera the fact here is she was speeding, she broke the law and now she has to pay. Get over it and pay the ticket and move on.
Right on Ed- Well put. It sounds like you've been caught in action a few times. lol...
Don't pay, then you can bail her out. Plus then her insurance premiums go up, so it's better to pay, then take the school, keep insurance premiums down.
Don't pay, then you can bail her out. Plus then her insurance premiums go up, so it's better to pay, then take the school, keep insurance premiums down.
I know exactly what happens when the ticket isn't paid, but if the courts aren't playing by the rules then why should the ticket be paid? I can't just hand a request for an extension to some random person at the court house, can I?
So, you got bagged speeding and don't want to pay.
Solution: Don't speed.
I'm no big fan of speed limits, or "traffic laws" in general, but really, if you get caught either go to court and fight it, or man the fuck up and pay it.
I hate to agree with Mike, but she got caught so just pay it. We have those cameras still in Iowa and make a lot of money off a lot of people, but at least here they don't affect your insurance premiums.
So, you got bagged speeding and don't want to pay.
Solution: Don't speed.
I'm no big fan of speed limits, or "traffic laws" in general, but really, if you get caught either go to court and fight it, or man the fuck up and pay it.
Which is exactly what she wants to do, but if they didn't follow the rules in serving the papers then this serve doesn't matter.
Which is exactly what she wants to do, but if they didn't follow the rules in serving the papers then this serve doesn't matter.
If you're going to fight it, what's the difference? The reailty is, is that if you go to court ccomplaining they gave a summons to a 15 year old the court will say sorry, or give some lame excuse as to why they COULD do it. Then they'll hear your girls case, find her guilty and you'll have to pay anyhow.
I got pulled over in Phoenix on I-10 by an Az trooper. Asked what I did since I know I wasn't speeding and he gave me the run around and said that my canteen, which had strategically come loose was covering my plate. Little did he know that I was covering it because of their cameras. Not sure how you can fight that one. I'd just pay it as much as it sucks and I hate that state and local governments are using cameras to make money.
I figured this forum would be a good place to ask. I guess not.
THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE. I AM NOT CERTIFIED TO GIVE LEGAL ADVICE. THIS IS A FRIENDLY SUGGESTION. THE INTERNET IS THE WORST PLACE TO GET LEGAL ADVICE AND YOU SHOULD CONSULT SOMEONE CERTIFIED TO PRACTICE IN YOUR JURISDICTION.
Federal Rules of Civil Procedure 12 (b) 5 is what you're looking for, but winning the battle definitely won't win the war if you appreciate the difference between "dismissed with discretion" and "dismissed without discretion." A judge or magistrate would probably throw that motion out faster than you can image. THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE. I AM NOT CERTIFIED TO GIVE LEGAL ADVICE. THIS IS A FRIENDLY SUGGESTION. THE INTERNET IS THE WORST PLACE TO GET LEGAL ADVICE AND YOU SHOULD CONSULT SOMEONE CERTIFIED TO PRACTICE IN YOUR JURISDICTION.
this is why i ride around with my plate in my pocket and signs of it obviously being broke off, i always say it just happened if they pull me over to hassel me about it
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